Discussion:
Do the Neo-Cons Need Karl Rove when they can Count on the Democrats?
(too old to reply)
Gandalf Grey
2007-08-17 18:39:19 UTC
Permalink
Do the neo-cons need Karl Rove when they can count on the Democrats?

By Harvey Wasserman
Created Aug 15 2007 - 9:03am

Karl Rove scoots off the sunken White House ship with his plans for future
neo-con dominance safe and secure---in the hands of Democrats unwilling or
incapable of challenging his dirtiest deeds.

Elected to end a lunatic war, the Democratic Congress has prolonged it,
earning approval ratings even lower than those of George W. Bush, whom Rove
designated as a "war president" long before the attack on Iraq.

The Democrats have also signed off on the GOP's all-out assault on the
Constitution, meekly certifying a "unitary executive" with totalitarian
demands for a blanket suspension of civil liberties, arbitrary detention,
official torture and more.

Once again voters will approach a presidential election asking
themselves---why vote for Democrats who won't challenge the most
catastrophic GOP outrages?

That question must now be asked again about the illegal destruction of 1.5
million ballots from Ohio's stolen 2004 election. The mass shredding
includes a wide range of official documents critical to conducting a valid
recount in the state that gave Bush/Rove a second term in the White House.

Breaking a total mainstream media blackout, the Cincinnati Enquirer has
finally printed a front-page story on the felonious disposal of these
federally-protected records by 56 of Ohio's 88 counties.

The records were shielded until September 2, 2006 by federal mandate, and
since then by a federal court order obtained through a class action lawsuit.
The counties were also required to inform the Ohio Historical Society before
any such records were destroyed.

The counties have responded to critics with an absurd array of "dog ate my
homework" excuses reminiscent of Rove's laptop during his lighter moments.
Some of the ballots were ruined by a coffee pot, says one county. Flooding
hit others, they say. In one county, recyclers were to blame. In another,
counterfeit ballots have been discovered.

In short, the excuses for destroying Ohio's election records are every bit
as credible as Rove saying he's resigning to "spend more time with my
family."

But far from reacting with outrage, the Democrats have merely shrugged, much
as they've done with the continuation of the Iraq War and the shredding of
the Constitution.

Ohio's Democratic Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner has told the media she
sees "no evidence" this mass deep-sixing of official records was done
"purposefully" by nearly two-thirds of the state's counties.

By contrast, under Republican Governor Jeb Bush, only one Florida county
destroyed its records and ballots from the 2000 election. The rest of the
materials are safely on file at a repository in Tallahassee. A thorough
media-sponsored investigation used them to conclude that Al Gore was the
rightful winner.

While campaigning in 2006, Brunner promised to establish a similar facility
in Columbus. Riding a huge popular revulsion against incumbent Republicans,
she won in a landslide that also ushered in a Democratic governor,
attorney-general and U.S. Senator.

But except for Freepress.org, no independent team has conducted a systematic
analysis of Ohio's 2004 election. Our conclusion remains that John Kerry was
the rightful winner. Evidence continuing to surface has deepened that
conviction.

As part of the King-Lincoln-Bronzeville lawsuit that secured a federal court
mandate for the protection of these materials, it was our expectation that
the Freepress.org and other media teams would have time to access those
preserved materials for a definitive, ultimately conclusive study.

In a new reality emblematic of the Age of Rove, that will now be impossible.

By all rights, the staff and election boards of all the 56 counties should
be subject to investigation and possible federal and state felony charges.

Emblematic of the Democratic Party in the Age of Rove, there seems no
movement in that direction.

In the wake of the destruction of these historic materials, Brunner has also
told the media she sees "no evidence" that Kerry could have won the 2004
election.

But Bush's official margin was less than 119,000 votes out of 5.4 million
counted, with exit polls showing him the clear winner. More than 100,000
ballots remain uncounted. The litany of ballot stuffing, electronic
manipulation, voter intimidation and fraud has now been overshadowed by the
illegal destruction of 1.5 million votes cast in precincts that had inflated
totals for Bush, according to exit polls. Essential auditing materials were
destroyed in the key Republican counties that gave Bush his official margin
of victory. In at least one of those counties, counterfeit ballots have
surfaced in large numbers.

The Democrats also don't seem to care that the servers used to compute the
Ohio 2004 vote count were the same ones that housed the web site for the
Republican National Committee.

Those servers (which were lodged in the basement of a bank in Chattanooga,
Tennessee) mysteriously "malfunctioned" during a critical period in the deep
night of the election when a 200,000-vote exit poll margin for John Kerry
somehow morphed into a victory for Bush/Rove. Rove's notoriously missing
"extra-official" e-mails flowed through those same servers.

Congressional Democrats now pursue Rove over the firing of federal attorneys
who refused to play along with the GOP plan to disenfranchise millions of
American voters in the lead-up to 2008. But Bush is certain to shield Rove
with a pardon, and the matter seems as likely to fade away as those 2004
ballots.

The fifteen months until the 2008 election can qualify as many lifetimes in
American politics. Unless the Democrats confront this horrendous war and
stop the obliteration of the American Constitution, they'll give voters
little reason to bother coming out for them in 2008.

And unless they face the realities of the last two stolen presidential
elections, Karl Rove's twisted vision for a neo-con America could easily
survive the loss of the presidency to a nominal Democrat in 2008, just as it
thrives unimpeded after the 2006 loss of Congress and the Ohio statehouse.
_______
--
NOTICE: This post contains copyrighted material the use of which has not
always been authorized by the copyright owner. I am making such material
available to advance understanding of
political, human rights, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues. I
believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of such copyrighted material as
provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright
Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107

"A little patience and we shall see the reign of witches pass over, their
spells dissolve, and the people recovering their true sight, restore their
government to its true principles. It is true that in the meantime we are
suffering deeply in spirit,
and incurring the horrors of a war and long oppressions of enormous public
debt. But if the game runs sometimes against us at home we must have
patience till luck turns, and then we shall have an opportunity of winning
back the principles we have lost, for this is a game where principles are at
stake."
-Thomas Jefferson
Jerry Okamura
2007-10-19 21:47:53 UTC
Permalink
"If" we as citizens are really concerned about solving this election
question, the answer is really simple. When we cast our vote, we should
demand and get the following. One, we get to keep a copy of the vote we
cast. Two, we get to check to see if the vote we cast was properly counted.
Third, there should be a check and balance system in place. When we cast
our vote electronically, we should also get a paper printout of our vote
(two copies would be better, one which we get to keep). Then when the vote
is counted, the electronic vote should match a count of the paper ballot
count....and for those who don't trust the system, we should be able to
check how our vote was counted. To determine that the person voting is
actually the person who is voting, and is an American Citizen, that is 21
years of age, they should show a valid ID, that is very hard to forge. We
should train the people who verify who can vote, by training them in knowing
what a real ID looks like. Are we doing that? NO, we are not....so stop
complaining about a system, when you are not willing to take the time and
effort to change the system.
Post by Gandalf Grey
Do the neo-cons need Karl Rove when they can count on the Democrats?
By Harvey Wasserman
Created Aug 15 2007 - 9:03am
Karl Rove scoots off the sunken White House ship with his plans for future
neo-con dominance safe and secure---in the hands of Democrats unwilling or
incapable of challenging his dirtiest deeds.
Elected to end a lunatic war, the Democratic Congress has prolonged it,
earning approval ratings even lower than those of George W. Bush, whom Rove
designated as a "war president" long before the attack on Iraq.
The Democrats have also signed off on the GOP's all-out assault on the
Constitution, meekly certifying a "unitary executive" with totalitarian
demands for a blanket suspension of civil liberties, arbitrary detention,
official torture and more.
Once again voters will approach a presidential election asking
themselves---why vote for Democrats who won't challenge the most
catastrophic GOP outrages?
That question must now be asked again about the illegal destruction of 1.5
million ballots from Ohio's stolen 2004 election. The mass shredding
includes a wide range of official documents critical to conducting a valid
recount in the state that gave Bush/Rove a second term in the White House.
Breaking a total mainstream media blackout, the Cincinnati Enquirer has
finally printed a front-page story on the felonious disposal of these
federally-protected records by 56 of Ohio's 88 counties.
The records were shielded until September 2, 2006 by federal mandate, and
since then by a federal court order obtained through a class action lawsuit.
The counties were also required to inform the Ohio Historical Society before
any such records were destroyed.
The counties have responded to critics with an absurd array of "dog ate my
homework" excuses reminiscent of Rove's laptop during his lighter moments.
Some of the ballots were ruined by a coffee pot, says one county. Flooding
hit others, they say. In one county, recyclers were to blame. In another,
counterfeit ballots have been discovered.
In short, the excuses for destroying Ohio's election records are every bit
as credible as Rove saying he's resigning to "spend more time with my
family."
But far from reacting with outrage, the Democrats have merely shrugged, much
as they've done with the continuation of the Iraq War and the shredding of
the Constitution.
Ohio's Democratic Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner has told the media she
sees "no evidence" this mass deep-sixing of official records was done
"purposefully" by nearly two-thirds of the state's counties.
By contrast, under Republican Governor Jeb Bush, only one Florida county
destroyed its records and ballots from the 2000 election. The rest of the
materials are safely on file at a repository in Tallahassee. A thorough
media-sponsored investigation used them to conclude that Al Gore was the
rightful winner.
While campaigning in 2006, Brunner promised to establish a similar facility
in Columbus. Riding a huge popular revulsion against incumbent
Republicans,
she won in a landslide that also ushered in a Democratic governor,
attorney-general and U.S. Senator.
But except for Freepress.org, no independent team has conducted a systematic
analysis of Ohio's 2004 election. Our conclusion remains that John Kerry was
the rightful winner. Evidence continuing to surface has deepened that
conviction.
As part of the King-Lincoln-Bronzeville lawsuit that secured a federal court
mandate for the protection of these materials, it was our expectation that
the Freepress.org and other media teams would have time to access those
preserved materials for a definitive, ultimately conclusive study.
In a new reality emblematic of the Age of Rove, that will now be impossible.
By all rights, the staff and election boards of all the 56 counties should
be subject to investigation and possible federal and state felony charges.
Emblematic of the Democratic Party in the Age of Rove, there seems no
movement in that direction.
In the wake of the destruction of these historic materials, Brunner has also
told the media she sees "no evidence" that Kerry could have won the 2004
election.
But Bush's official margin was less than 119,000 votes out of 5.4 million
counted, with exit polls showing him the clear winner. More than 100,000
ballots remain uncounted. The litany of ballot stuffing, electronic
manipulation, voter intimidation and fraud has now been overshadowed by the
illegal destruction of 1.5 million votes cast in precincts that had inflated
totals for Bush, according to exit polls. Essential auditing materials were
destroyed in the key Republican counties that gave Bush his official margin
of victory. In at least one of those counties, counterfeit ballots have
surfaced in large numbers.
The Democrats also don't seem to care that the servers used to compute the
Ohio 2004 vote count were the same ones that housed the web site for the
Republican National Committee.
Those servers (which were lodged in the basement of a bank in Chattanooga,
Tennessee) mysteriously "malfunctioned" during a critical period in the deep
night of the election when a 200,000-vote exit poll margin for John Kerry
somehow morphed into a victory for Bush/Rove. Rove's notoriously missing
"extra-official" e-mails flowed through those same servers.
Congressional Democrats now pursue Rove over the firing of federal attorneys
who refused to play along with the GOP plan to disenfranchise millions of
American voters in the lead-up to 2008. But Bush is certain to shield Rove
with a pardon, and the matter seems as likely to fade away as those 2004
ballots.
The fifteen months until the 2008 election can qualify as many lifetimes in
American politics. Unless the Democrats confront this horrendous war and
stop the obliteration of the American Constitution, they'll give voters
little reason to bother coming out for them in 2008.
And unless they face the realities of the last two stolen presidential
elections, Karl Rove's twisted vision for a neo-con America could easily
survive the loss of the presidency to a nominal Democrat in 2008, just as it
thrives unimpeded after the 2006 loss of Congress and the Ohio statehouse.
_______
--
NOTICE: This post contains copyrighted material the use of which has not
always been authorized by the copyright owner. I am making such material
available to advance understanding of
political, human rights, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues. I
believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of such copyrighted material as
provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright
Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107
"A little patience and we shall see the reign of witches pass over, their
spells dissolve, and the people recovering their true sight, restore their
government to its true principles. It is true that in the meantime we are
suffering deeply in spirit,
and incurring the horrors of a war and long oppressions of enormous public
debt. But if the game runs sometimes against us at home we must have
patience till luck turns, and then we shall have an opportunity of winning
back the principles we have lost, for this is a game where principles are at
stake."
-Thomas Jefferson
C***@Knicklas.com
2007-10-20 15:14:02 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:47:53 -1000, "Jerry Okamura"
Post by Jerry Okamura
"If" we as citizens are really concerned about solving this election
question, the answer is really simple. When we cast our vote, we should
demand and get the following. One, we get to keep a copy of the vote we
cast. Two, we get to check to see if the vote we cast was properly counted.
Third, there should be a check and balance system in place. When we cast
our vote electronically, we should also get a paper printout of our vote
(two copies would be better, one which we get to keep). Then when the vote
is counted, the electronic vote should match a count of the paper ballot
count....and for those who don't trust the system, we should be able to
check how our vote was counted. To determine that the person voting is
actually the person who is voting, and is an American Citizen, that is 21
years of age, they should show a valid ID, that is very hard to forge. We
should train the people who verify who can vote, by training them in knowing
what a real ID looks like. Are we doing that? NO, we are not....so stop
complaining about a system, when you are not willing to take the time and
effort to change the system.
Which needs massive amounts of funding......

Which is stymied by the oft used phrase: "No New
Taxes"

A conservative answer
Patriot Games
2007-10-20 21:18:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:47:53 -1000, "Jerry Okamura"
"If" we as citizens...
Which needs massive amounts of funding......
Which is stymied by the oft used phrase: "No New
Taxes"
A conservative answer
Pelosi said no new taxes last year and promptly proved that was a lie...

Lying, the liberal answer.
C***@Knicklas.com
2007-10-21 03:56:42 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 17:18:53 -0400, "Patriot Games"
Post by Patriot Games
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:47:53 -1000, "Jerry Okamura"
"If" we as citizens...
Which needs massive amounts of funding......
Which is stymied by the oft used phrase: "No New
Taxes"
A conservative answer
Pelosi said no new taxes last year and promptly proved that was a lie...
Lying, the liberal answer.
Pelosi said nothing of the kind

However, "lying" wasn't the issue

In either case you lose big time.

The lies of Nixon, Reagan, Bush 1 and 2, along with
Neutie and the 1994 fuckwits are legendary.

The only lie that wasn't told by republicans prior to
gaining power, was----that the Republican party
intended to make the wealthy a lot more richer and the
intention to curtail the rights, and fortunes of
everyone else.
Patriot Games
2007-10-21 15:37:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 17:18:53 -0400, "Patriot Games"
Post by Patriot Games
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:47:53 -1000, "Jerry Okamura"
"If" we as citizens...
Which needs massive amounts of funding......
Which is stymied by the oft used phrase: "No New
Taxes"
A conservative answer
Pelosi said no new taxes last year and promptly proved that was a lie...
Lying, the liberal answer.
Pelosi said nothing of the kind
"...we are committed to pay as you go. No new deficit spending." Pelosi,
01/08/07

"We want to have pay-go, no new deficit spending." Pelosi, 01/08/07

http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2007/cyb20070108.asp#1
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
However, "lying" wasn't the issue
In either case you lose big time.
No, I not only DON'T LOSE but I clearly PROVED YOU ARE A LIAR.

Please take your public school dumb-as-a-stump nigger ass off the street and
go sit on the porch with the rest of the small dogs.
C***@Knicklas.com
2007-10-21 22:51:23 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 11:37:14 -0400, "Patriot Games"
Post by Patriot Games
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
Pelosi said nothing of the kind
"...we are committed to pay as you go. No new deficit spending." Pelosi,
01/08/07
Wheres "no new taxes"?

You claimed she said she wouldn't raise taxes---then
counter with "pay as you go"

"Pay as you go" might require TAKING AWAY some of the
tax cuts reagan and Bush gave the wealthy---or "raising
taxes"---Which is okay if you don't deficit spend.
Post by Patriot Games
"We want to have pay-go, no new deficit spending." Pelosi, 01/08/07
http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2007/cyb20070108.asp#1
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
However, "lying" wasn't the issue
In either case you lose big time.
No, I not only DON'T LOSE but I clearly PROVED YOU ARE A LIAR.
You just proved that not only don't you under stand
the difference between "deficit spending" and
"taxation", but don't even understand you were made to
look stupid.
Post by Patriot Games
Please take your public school dumb-as-a-stump nigger ass off the street and
go sit on the porch with the rest of the small dogs.
This "small dog" just kicked your ass.
Patriot Games
2007-10-22 14:15:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 11:37:14 -0400, "Patriot Games"
Post by Patriot Games
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
Pelosi said nothing of the kind
"...we are committed to pay as you go. No new deficit spending." Pelosi,
01/08/07
Wheres "no new taxes"?
Its in-between "...we are committed to pay as you go" and "No new deficit
spending."
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
You claimed she said she wouldn't raise taxes---then
counter with "pay as you go"
"Pay as you go" might require TAKING AWAY some of the
tax cuts reagan and Bush gave the wealthy
That's a tax increase.
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
or "raising taxes"---Which is okay if you don't deficit spend.
It proves she's a liar.
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
Post by Patriot Games
"We want to have pay-go, no new deficit spending." Pelosi, 01/08/07
http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2007/cyb20070108.asp#1
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
However, "lying" wasn't the issue
In either case you lose big time.
No, I not only DON'T LOSE but I clearly PROVED YOU ARE A LIAR.
You just proved that not only don't you under stand
the difference between "deficit spending" and
"taxation", but don't even understand you were made to
look stupid.
Sorry, liar. You've been BUSTED.
Post by C***@Knicklas.com
Post by Patriot Games
Please take your public school dumb-as-a-stump nigger ass off the street and
go sit on the porch with the rest of the small dogs.
This "small dog" just kicked your ass.
Sorry, liar. You've been BUSTED.

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